Re: [FFmpeg-devel] Democratization

[Vittorio Giovara <vittorio.giovara@gmail.com>]

On Wed, Jan 29, 2025 at 12:52 PM Soft Works <
softworkz-at-hotmail.com@ffmpeg.org> wrote:

>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: ffmpeg-devel <ffmpeg-devel-bounces@ffmpeg.org> On Behalf Of
> > Vittorio Giovara
> > Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2025 11:51 AM
> > To: FFmpeg development discussions and patches <ffmpeg-
> > devel@ffmpeg.org>
> > On Wed, Jan 29, 2025 at 11:32 AM Soft Works <
> > softworkz-at-hotmail.com@ffmpeg.org> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: ffmpeg-devel <ffmpeg-devel-bounces@ffmpeg.org> On Behalf Of
> > > > Vittorio Giovara
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2025 10:45 AM
> > > > To: FFmpeg development discussions and patches <ffmpeg-
> > > > devel@ffmpeg.org>
> > > > Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] Democratization
> > > >
> > > > On Tue, Jan 28, 2025 at 7:21 PM Michael Niedermayer
> > > > <michael@niedermayer.cc>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > About people pointing to me as the cause of something they do.
> > > > > Given iam in this project for over 20 years and iam the main
> > author
> > > > and
> > > > > we had a fork long ago. With many people joining back together.
> > > > There are
> > > > > people who have had past hate and present hate towards me.
> > > > > Whenever there is an oppertunity, some will point to me as teh
> > > > > cause.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Well "look who it is the consequences of my own actions"
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > It makes sense to look at these and ask "do they point to a
> > real
> > > > issue?"
> > > > > is there something we can learn and improve or is this just
> > dislike
> > > > towards
> > > > > me and are they just asking for me to be "hanged"/"removed".
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Who banned someone without cause and due process, and deleted the
> > > > archive?
> > > > Who is undermining the GA and filibustering the ffmpeg
> > governance?
> > > > Who prevented the previous CC from operating?
> > > > Who is ignoring the scam of the ffmpeg booths at trade shows?
> > > > Who helped keep relevant parts of the infrastructure hidden for
> > > > years?
> > > > Who is preventing new roots from joining and actual
> > infrastructure
> > > > work
> > > > being done?
> > > > Who posted insulting images on social networks?
> > > > Who quoted the STF an unreasonable amount of money for a project
> > that
> > > > *everybody* agrees is not worth that much?
> > > > Who argued for MONTHS about dubious code features, and pushed
> > code
> > > > (later
> > > > reverted) to the main tree because it served their own branch?
> > > > Who is refusing to join community discussions in person (or
> > > > remotely), and
> > > > keeps posting walls of text that are hard to track and makes
> > > > following the
> > > > discussion harder than needs to be?
> > > > Who is pretending to be democratic and trying to appear as a
> > martyr,
> > > > causing people to leave while they actually wanted to contribute
> > and
> > > > help
> > > > steward this community?
> > > >
> > > > I don't want to get banned again for posting a bullet list, but I
> > > > definitely see a pattern. AND THIS IS JUST IN THE LAST SIX
> > MONTHS.
> > > >
> > > > The thing is NOBODY wants to see you hanged or removed, we're
> > just
> > > > pleading
> > > > to your common sense and that you listen to the community,
> > allowing
> > > > for an
> > > > independent governance to effectively operate ffmpeg. If you
> > can't
> > > > satisfy
> > > > the community requests, then yes, the "unfriendly emails" will
> > > > continue
> > > > until this behavior is put to an end. And I know you won't
> > believe me
> > > > because I'm from "the other side", but once again I invite you to
> > the
> > > > FOSDEM ffmpeg meeting and see what the community really thinks
> > and
> > > > wants
> > > > for yourself.
> > > >
> > > > I do belive one big part of some people leaving over the last
> > years
> > > > is that
> > > > > they are not enough in power.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > This reads like "I want them to be good minions while I continue
> > to
> > > > do what
> > > > I want", but you're right it's off topic.
> > >
> > >
> > > for (i=0; i<12; i++) {
> > >     print("You did this you did that");
> > > }
> > >
> > > if (!(<give us control over ffmpeg>)) {
> > >     for (i=0; i<1000; i++) {
> > >         sendEmail("<more accusations>");
> > >     }
> > > }
> > >
> > >
> > > Sounds like the accusations are more a leverage than a concern..?
> > >
> >
> > Sounds like you are not adding anything to the discussion, but thanks
> > for
> > sharing your view.
>
> You're very welcome, but which discussion?
>
> If this is the way you are discussing, then I don't want to see you
> shit-storming. 😃
> I haven't followed the stories behind those individual points you are
> listing - I read a bit through things but for most of them, I'm not in a
> position (from knowledge) to do any judgement.
>
> But what I can judge is your way of communication and presentation, plus
> the fact that this is at least the 4th repetition of the same content in
> the same aggressive form.
>
> It is obvious that you are not interested in resolving the individual
> "points" you are listing. You want to gain more control over all aspects of
> the ffmpeg project (for "the community") and to fund that argument, you
> have assembled that list of "bad incidents" that all wouldn't have happened
> when the project would under control of somebody else (like you? >> or
> course "backed" by the community).
>
> But community or not - it's always actual persons who have certain powers
> in their hands.
> And my personal view on that is that those who are speaking up so loudly
> and dirty for gaining control are the very last ones to which I would want
> to give such powers.
>

You are skewing the discuscussion and attacking me while constructing a
conspiracy theory that is not true (I don't want to gain any control at
all, I want a community-decided process for most of the problems I raised)
and contracting yourself while at at it (the loudest by length and number
of mails on the subject is definitely not me).

Please just do better.
-- 
Vittorio
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