Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [PATCH v2] ogg/vorbis: implement header packet skip in chained ogg bitstreams.

[Yalda via ffmpeg-devel <ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org>]

Thanks Romain. I am experimenting with this and trying the patches.


On Wed, Aug 13, 2025 at 8:46 AM Romain Beauxis <romain.beauxis@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Le mer. 13 août 2025 à 08:44, Romain Beauxis
> <romain.beauxis@gmail.com> a écrit :
> >
> > Le mar. 12 août 2025 à 14:49, Romain Beauxis
> > <romain.beauxis@gmail.com> a écrit :
> > >
> > > Hi!
> > >
> > > Le mar. 12 août 2025 à 11:33, Yalda <marth64@proxyid.net> a écrit :
> > > >
> > > > Romain Beauxis:
> > > >
> > > > Thank you, Romain, for the clarity.
> > > >
> > > > I have some follow up questions just to solidify my understanding.
> > > > I think this is a good match since this sounds like a segment joining
> > > > problem which is ironically what I have been doing in principle
> > > > with my other contributions.
> > >
> > > Nice!
> > >
> > > > 1) Can core stream parameters (channels, sample rate) change mid-flight?
> > >
> > > In theory, yes. The two streams do not have to have anything in common.
> > >
> > > In practice, most of the situations where this happens are because the encoder wants to insert an in-band metadata so it's pretty reasonable to assume that encoding parameters are unlikely to change between streams, at least as a first approach.
> > >
> > > > 2) Why are the header packets emitted to begin with?
> > > > Are they necessary for the audible bitstream or preamble metadata?
> > > > Alternatively, a link to external reading is fine by me!
> > >
> > > You got the link I see :-)
> > >
> > > In ogg, there's usually at least 2 to 3 packets:
> > > 1. "hello" packet to detect the logical stream content. All first packets of all multiplexed streams are placed inside an initial page.
> > > 2. One metadata packet
> > > 3. Optionally: one or more codec specific packets
> > >
> > > (Similarly to considering theora as deprecated, I would also ignore the multiplexing aspect of the problem, at least in a first approach. Ogg streams with audio/video content are also pretty rare these days.)
> > >
> > > The codec specific packets can contain data required for the decoder.
> > >
> > > In practice, it seems that in ffmpeg, with ogg/flac and ogg/opus, the decoders are pretty happy continuing their decoding without having to process any new header packet.
> > >
> > > For opus, there does not seem to be any codec-specific header: https://wiki.xiph.org/OggOpus
> > >
> > > For flac, the spec says one or more metadata packets and no codec-specific packet: https://xiph.org/flac/ogg_mapping.html
> > >
> > > For those two codecs, the current libavcodec decoders are pretty happy without those mid-stream headers.
> > >
> > > With vorbis, the stream has one metadata packet and one codec specific packet that seems required to continue decoding.
> > >
> > > Thus, the current libavcodec vorbis decoder has to receive and process mid-stream headers, which is why suppressing those from the demuxer output was a trickier task and why this current patch is a hold-out.
> > >
> > > > 3) Is it possible that doing the stream copy is a front-line goal in actuality?
> > > > In other words, by solving 1/2/3, we are actually wanting to solve 4?
> > > > (If this thought makes sense)
> > >
> > > The most pressing user-facing features are: supporting in-band metadata and copy streams.
> > >
> > > In-band metadata is just a few commits behind the current pending one. I was looking at them yesterday, they are really super simple.
> > >
> > > These changes are blocked by the completion of the proper handling of header packets since metadata are passed through them.
> > >
> > > Supporting copy streams is more tricky as it will require fixing DTS and handling new ogg headers when generating the output streams.
> > >
> > > I do have most of this sketched out in my local FFmpeg repo.
> > >
> > > > 4) Is there a sample command to spawn such a source stream, or is setting
> > > > up Icecast with defaults enough and play segments to simulate the conditions?
> >
> > Sorry I'm realizing you meant a live stream here.
> >
> > You can use liquidsoap, which should be easily installable via the
> > binary packages here:
> > https://github.com/savonet/liquidsoap/releases/tag/v2.3.3
> >
> > Or using `opam`:
> > https://www.liquidsoap.info/doc-2.3.3/install.html#install-using-opam
> > (make sure to install the vorbis package and also ffmpeg for decoding!)
> >
> > A simple script could be:
>
> Huh, sorry:
> ```shell
> % cal icecast-playlist.liq
>
>                    18h 36m 5s 08:45:37
> s = playlist("~/sources/test-stream/audio")
>
> output.icecast(
>   fallible=true,
>   mount="test",
>   %vorbis,
>   s
> )
>
> % liquidsoap ./icecast-playlist.liq
> ```
>
> >
> > Alternatively you could pick any of the ogg/{opus, flac, vorbis}
> > stream in the xiph directory: https://dir.xiph.org/codecs/Vorbis
> >
> > Thanks,
> > -- Romain
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