From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from ffbox0-bg.mplayerhq.hu (ffbox0-bg.ffmpeg.org [79.124.17.100]) by master.gitmailbox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AF9847E5C for ; Sun, 29 Oct 2023 16:13:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [127.0.1.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ffbox0-bg.mplayerhq.hu (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA00768CBE7; Sun, 29 Oct 2023 18:13:06 +0200 (EET) Received: from relay8-d.mail.gandi.net (relay8-d.mail.gandi.net [217.70.183.201]) by ffbox0-bg.mplayerhq.hu (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4B87768C96A for ; Sun, 29 Oct 2023 18:13:00 +0200 (EET) Received: by mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 640C51BF204 for ; Sun, 29 Oct 2023 16:12:59 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2023 17:12:58 +0100 From: Michael Niedermayer To: FFmpeg development discussions and patches Message-ID: <20231029161258.GK3543730@pb2> References: <20231026154523.GI3543730@pb2> <4c66cd67-88fb-0702-8cc2-af8968f81791@mail.de> <20231028172103.GD3543730@pb2> <20231028180157.GE3543730@pb2> <06FDD42E-0549-437C-9827-C21CBFD005BE@remlab.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <06FDD42E-0549-437C-9827-C21CBFD005BE@remlab.net> X-GND-Sasl: michael@niedermayer.cc Subject: Re: [FFmpeg-devel] [RFC] financial sustainability Plan A (SPI) X-BeenThere: ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: FFmpeg development discussions and patches List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: FFmpeg development discussions and patches Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============8752783641185475880==" Errors-To: ffmpeg-devel-bounces@ffmpeg.org Sender: "ffmpeg-devel" Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Post: --===============8752783641185475880== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="TyPCAcMxVPCe0YbJ" Content-Disposition: inline --TyPCAcMxVPCe0YbJ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Oct 29, 2023 at 04:35:35PM +0200, R=C3=A9mi Denis-Courmont wrote: > Hi, >=20 > Le 28 octobre 2023 21:01:57 GMT+03:00, Michael Niedermayer a =C3=A9crit=C2=A0: > >On Sat, Oct 28, 2023 at 07:21:03PM +0200, Michael Niedermayer wrote: > >> Hi ronald > >>=20 > >> On Sat, Oct 28, 2023 at 12:43:15PM -0400, Ronald S. Bultje wrote: > >> > Hi Thilo, > >> >=20 > >> > On Sat, Oct 28, 2023 at 11:31=E2=80=AFAM Thilo Borgmann via ffmpeg-d= evel < > >> > ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org> wrote: > >> >=20 > >> > > What this is about, is to set up a way to properly spend the SPI m= oney > >> > > aside > >> > > from travel & hw. Why we should not do it because some companies > >> > > beurocracy, I > >> > > cannot see. > >> > > > >> >=20 > >> > I sincerely don't think the above description is what Kieran meant w= hen he > >> > talked about sustainability at Demuxed, which this thread seems to b= e a > >> > response to. > >>=20 > >> a quick reply here. I have not watched kierans presentation from demux= ed yet. > >> So theres absolutly no chance anything i wrote till now can be a respo= ne to > >> it. > > > >some more words about what the intend of this plan was, again not a resp= one > >to any presentation of anyone else > > > >Donations from people vs companies: both really. >=20 > I think Ronald's point is that you need to pick one, and clarify which it= is, because as Ronald explained, it's unlikely that a *good* plan could ad= dress both (conversely a plan that tries to address both is probably poor a= nd flawed). >=20 > In other words, if you want to cover both cases, you need two separate pl= ans. you are correct, i agree here but this is a RFC so its not a final plan. i think for the donations from users the real question is how many of our users can we reach to explain them that they are using FFmpeg and a tiny donation would help us alot. if thats only a few thousand users then this will not work >=20 > And unfortunately, I do believe that Ronald is correct in pointing out th= at big companies will want oversight in exchange for money. This is very mu= ch counter to the current project setup, which (depending whom you ask) is = governed by the GA, or by Fabrice Bellard through his delegates. >=20 > This is not to say that these corporate wishes should or should not be ac= comodated. It is just an observation of those wishes. if i look at spi.txt, it says "SPI needs a contract in place which describes the work to be done. " so if we have someone do some payed development work be that one time or continous. There would be a contract that says what is going to be done. That also would have been approved by the community or GA or whatver and the company paying would have a say in whats in that contract, really limited by what we are ok with and what the law allows >=20 > >Peoples donations would only matter if we can increase awareness of peop= le > >using FFmpeg. We have over a billion users but they dont know it. > >if each user gives us 1cent per year our sustainability is solved. > >So driving awareness alone would solve this already, even if only 0.1% > >of users would donate 10$ per year that would do. >=20 > How do you plan to gain visibility from those billion users? Call me pess= imistic but this has been a known problem for 20+ years, and I have yet to = glimpse a credible solution. It depends on the community. If the commuity wants to do it Just look at some online service which annoy you telling you to disable a a= dd blocker we could detect a specific usecase we intend to target and print a simple m= essage once that will not annoy the user a 2nd time This is very controversal and iam not sure if 99% are against it or find it= funny. Iam just awnsering the "how it can be done" not saying iam in favor or agai= nst [...] --=20 Michael GnuPG fingerprint: 9FF2128B147EF6730BADF133611EC787040B0FAB It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong. -- Voltaire --TyPCAcMxVPCe0YbJ Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iF0EABEIAB0WIQSf8hKLFH72cwut8TNhHseHBAsPqwUCZT6EhwAKCRBhHseHBAsP qzF4AJ4p/VRzy6rox4kzrmUlsXfQfLmsbwCdFH163kUe1MViWJWA9Ihtu3Rsgy0= =Eb9U -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --TyPCAcMxVPCe0YbJ-- --===============8752783641185475880== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ ffmpeg-devel mailing list ffmpeg-devel@ffmpeg.org https://ffmpeg.org/mailman/listinfo/ffmpeg-devel To unsubscribe, visit link above, or email ffmpeg-devel-request@ffmpeg.org with subject "unsubscribe". --===============8752783641185475880==--